Festivum face black???

[mamaschild]

I hope someone can

help. About a week ago, my 8" Festivum started looking like someone punched him in the face

http://cichlid.ipbhost.com/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif One side is black, and over the last few

days, he has stopped eating, lost movement in his pectoral on the black side, and is hanging nose

down in the plants most of the time. I thought I was loosing him yesterday because he was quite

pale, but he seems to have regained some color. He still swims around occassionally, but goes into

a nose dive as soon as he stops.

Water perameters
Ph 7.6
Gh12
Kh 7
78-80 F
0 Ammonia and NitrItes
~10 Nitrates
Weekly water changes and vacs.

He's housed in a 125g with Clown and Kubotai loaches that show no signs of stress.

Photos from 1-31-07
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/AquaGeek/125g/IMG_0769.jpg
healthy side
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/AquaGeek/125g/IMG_0773.jpg
"bruised" side (which is now almost black)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/AquaGeek/125g/IMG_0779.jpg

And video from 2-4-07
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/AquaGeek/th_MVI_0820.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v699/AquaGeek/?action=view¤t=MVI_0820.flv)

Please, anything????? I've had him since he

was a quarter sized little guy over 3 years ago. We haven't moved or anything.......

[mamaschild]

Anybody get the indication

this could be a Thyroid Tumor?????

That's been suggested just today.......

[fishmaven]

<!--quoteo

(post=3824:date=Feb 7 2007, 09:03 PM:name=mamaschild)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

(mamaschild @ Feb 7 2007, 09:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3824"><

{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Anybody get the indication this

could be a Thyroid Tumor?????

That's been suggested just today.......<!--QuoteEnd--

></div>
I thought the thyroid would be near the throat...

I've

read that a blackened area might be stroke related. Dan

[mamaschild]

So wierd....Stroke was one

of the first things we thought.......

However the Thyroid tumor was suggested because

his gill plate is sticking out a bit, and "the tumor could be pressing on the color

gland"?

[Mike Wise]

<!--quoteo

(post=3832:date=Feb 8 2007, 05:13 AM:name=fishmaven)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fishmaven

@ Feb 8 2007, 05:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3832"><{POST_SNAPBACK}

></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I thought the thyroid would be near the

throat...

I've read that a blackened area might be stroke related. Dan<!--QuoteEnd-

-></div>

Yes, this is typical of fish with nerve damage - either a

stroke of swelling around a nerve. Usually it is permanent, but if whatever is affecting the nerve

is removed, it might go away. If the fish does not seem stressed by it, it should be otherwise OK

[mamaschild]

<!--quoteo

(post=3837:date=Feb 8 2007, 08:42 AM:name=Mike Wise)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mike Wise

@ Feb 8 2007, 08:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3837"><{POST_SNAPBACK}

></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Yes, this is typical of fish with nerve damage -

either a stroke of swelling around a nerve. Usually it is permanent, but if whatever is affecting

the nerve is removed, it might go away. If the fish does not seem stressed by it, it should be

otherwise OK</div>


Appreciate the reply, Mike.

Unfortunately, he is not going to be ok unless he starts eating again http://cichlid.ipbhost.com/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif He also can not remain upright. He nosedives if he stops

swimming. He's been making a point to go to the plants where he can rest, but....

How could whatever is affecting the nerve, be removed???

[Mike Wise]

<!--quoteo

(post=3843:date=Feb 8 2007, 02:59 PM:name=mamaschild)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

(mamaschild @ Feb 8 2007, 02:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3843"><

{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Appreciate the reply, Mike.

Unfortunately, he is not going to be ok unless he starts eating again http://cichlid.ipbhost.com/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif He also can not remain upright. He nosedives if he stops

swimming. He's been making a point to go to the plants where he can rest, but....

How could whatever is affecting the nerve, be removed???</div>

Seems like your fish has an internal bacterial disease that is causing some swelling of

tissue around the nerve, so the blackness is a secondary symptom. Since your fish isn't eating,

you need to cure the disease with a medicine that is absorbed through the skin/gills (not easy).

Maybe someone else out there can suggest a broad spectrum antibiotic for this?

[fishmaven]

<!--quoteo

(post=3856:date=Feb 10 2007, 09:42 AM:name=Mike Wise)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mike Wise

@ Feb 10 2007, 09:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3856"><{POST_SNAPBACK}

></a></div><div class='quotemain'>Seems like your fish has an internal bacterial

disease that is causing some swelling of tissue around the nerve, so the blackness is a secondary

symptom. Since your fish isn't eating, you need to cure the disease with a medicine that is

absorbed through the skin/gills (not easy). Maybe someone else out there can suggest a broad

spectrum antibiotic for this?</div>
I'd think it really

optimistic to try treating symptoms of a stroke with an antibiotic but if you must...Kanamycin and

Furanace are the most easily purchased meds to cross the gill membrane. Please, if this works, give

us feedback on your dosage and treatment regimen. Dan

[Mike Wise]

<!--quoteo

(post=3857:date=Feb 10 2007, 11:39 AM:name=fishmaven)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fishmaven

@ Feb 10 2007, 11:39 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3857"><{POST_SNAPBACK}

></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I'd think it really optimistic to try treating

symptoms of a stroke with an antibiotic but if you must...Kanamycin and Furanace are the most

easily purchased meds to cross the gill membrane. Please, if this works, give us feedback on your

dosage and treatment regimen. Dan</div>

Such darkening

can be caused by either a stroke (in the brain) or pressure on a nerve due to swelling. Based on

the other problems described it seems that it is not a stroke.

[fisher]

long but low amounts of the

best sea salt you can find and try to adjust the water salinity to a maximum of salt that the fish

may take and plenty of airation, have some water ready with a little multi-cure to aid the growth

of the slime coat and with a well planted aquarium for him/her to get plenty of bacteria growth

combined with natural foods to suppliment nutrients and vitamen loss. process the fish till expect

it may be close to loss of senses and near close death and begin a phsycological re training of the

nerves and senses. TRUST ME under careful duress and attention you can retrain a simple nervous

system failure. If all else fails give it a blast and show your fish some love or it may become

scared and become ill

[mamaschild]

<!--quoteo

(post=3866:date=Feb 12 2007, 01:12 AM:name=fisher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fisher

@ Feb 12 2007, 01:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3866"><{POST_SNAPBACK}

></a></div><div class='quotemain'>long but low amounts of the best sea salt you can

find and try to adjust the water salinity to a maximum of salt that the fish may take and plenty of

airation, have some water ready with a little multi-cure to aid the growth of the slime coat and

with a well planted aquarium for him/her to get plenty of bacteria growth combined with natural

foods to suppliment nutrients and vitamen loss. process the fish till expect it may be close to

loss of senses and near close death and begin a phsycological re training of the nerves and senses.

TRUST ME under careful duress and attention you can retrain a simple nervous system failure. If all

else fails give it a blast and show your fish some love or it may become scared and become ill<!--

QuoteEnd--></div>


I'm sorry fisher, but I don't understand

your advise???? I got adding sea salt and having the tank well planted, but what is a "Multi

-cure"? What do you mean by "process the fish till expect it may be close to loss of

senses and near close death and begin a phsycological re training of the nerves and senses"

and just how do I do that???

Also, how do I "give it a blast"?

I

always show my fish love and the majority have no fear of me whatsoever.....but is that what you

mean??

[fisher]

<!--quoteo(post=3878:date=Feb

13 2007, 11:22 AM:name=mamaschild)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mamaschild @ Feb 13

2007, 11:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> (index.php?act=findpost&pid=3878)</div><div

class='quotemain'>I'm sorry fisher, but I don't understand your advise????

I got adding sea salt and having the tank well planted, but what is a "Multi-cure"? What

do you mean by "process the fish till expect it may be close to loss of senses and near close

death and begin a phsycological re training of the nerves and senses" and just how do I do

that???

Also, how do I "give it a blast"?

I always show my fish

love and the majority have no fear of me whatsoever.....but is that what you mean??<!--QuoteEnd--

></div>
have a go at what i suggested if all else fails and the tumor or

interrupted nerve pattern gets to you or the fish shows signs of death give the little beauty a

special care of attention than more and lather him with his own domain of similar size area of what

you have, homes, temp, ph and the rest of lifes little goodies.

Apply the fish to a new

lifestyle of living and provide a cycle of maximum tolerance to salt and than slowly bring him/her

back to their preferred environment, over a period of 6 to 9 months of easy feeding, sheltered

living, special care and attention for the everlasting handling of your beloved friend, drugging

the little beauty on trancfers does help if you can get your hands on some, though careful dosages

a required.

Learn and know all of your fishes attitude and actions for evidence of total

happiness and safety without any interruptions, as if your fish is to be incubated in an isolated

area with no disruptions apart from your feeding and treating as if you too where a physician for

your friend. Remember lights are an important cycle to the hours of temperature in your day. I

shall find the brand and specifics for you on multi-cure, basic fungal and slime-coat

regenerator."give it a blast" well sought of means have a shot at it, or give it a try,

if all else fails. Sorry for the aussie

slang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Beers

all round

[Lisachromis]

There is another disease

that shows up with black as shown in your pics. Myco. I'm not saying it is or isn't myco,

but it is a possibility that you ought to keep in mind. The following link gives you some

information about myco.

http://members.optushome.com.au/chelmon/Myco.htm

[fishmaven]

<!--quoteo

(post=3883:date=Feb 14 2007, 03:04 PM:name=Lisachromis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

(Lisachromis @ Feb 14 2007, 03:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=3883"><

{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>There is another disease that shows

up with black as shown in your pics. Myco. I'm not saying it is or isn't myco, but it is a

possibility that you ought to keep in mind. The following link gives you some information about

myco.

http://members.optushome.com.au/chelmon/Myco.htm</div><!--

QuoteEEnd-->
Thanks, Lisa. This is an extremely good info source. A reminder to any that read

this thread, <span style="color:#ff0000">this is one of the

diseases that can travel to a human from a fish.

<span

style="color:#000000">IMO, most imports from a commercial breeding facility are

probable carriers. It's likely that fish obtained within the USA from commercial breeders have

been exposed at some point and could also be carriers.

The author of the info sheet

points out the hazards of feeding contaminated fish to other fish, thus progressing the disease.

I'd point out that feeding dead fish to other fish that you value is pretty stupid on all

points. Just don't do it. Okay, if the fish jumped and you stepped on it, you could consider it

safe to feed it, if you want to handle the yucky remains. <grin> Dan
<!--colorc--

></span></span>

[mamaschild]

Just wanted to thank you

all for the replies.

Unfortunately, we had to euthanize him last night. He had not

eaten in almost 2 weeks and I could not bear to have him starve to death.

I had the

pleasure of Festi's company for 4 years, and he will be missed....sorry if that's corney,

but he WAS a pet http://cichlid.ipbhost.com/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif