I should stop being suprised

[Mullet]

http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/content.php?sid=2962&utm_source=PFK_newsletter&utm _medium=email&utm_campaign=July_1_2010&utm_term=Fl uorescent_cichlids_produced_in_Taiwan&utm_content= html

[ikevi]

I always have mixed feelings when I see things like this. I never complain about all the great plants that have been created via these types of methods. (IE almost all of your fruit/flower, etc have been genetically modified.) It sounds like at least for the convicts that have literally altered their genes, and are not injecting anything into the fish after the first generation. (And so far it has breed true for 5 generations.) Finally if it gets people into the hobby is it a bad thing? As for the Angels it wonder if the genes have actually changed or if each generation needs to be treated.

(That said I think the fish look ugly, but again at least these are more humane than say tattooed fish at least for the convicts.)

[Mrfiremouth]

Wow! Did you read the article? 60 Million Dollars for glow in the dark fish!!!!!!!!!!
Does anyone wonder why now??????????

I saw one good thing, the convicts would make killer large mouth bass bait! They are naturally chartreuse and have a natural fishy scent! LOL I can see them at Bass Pro Shops now!

Seriously, $60,000,000.oo a year! Wow!

[bobrfish]

$60 mil is an investment in technology. Are you ready for transgenetic humans?
It will not start with fluroescence knotheads walking around but in medical repairs or cures.
Then transgenetic individuals will appear on street as designer humans to enhance some aspect of themselves.

It is a brave NEW world.

[N. brichardi]

O.K. so First it was Glofish, now it's glow in the dark convicts and angelfish. What's next? Glow in the dark plecos? Bob by the way you're right the convicts would make awesome bass bait.

[dreday]

its pretty cool technology. i just see it starting with fish and going on from there.


and i think the convicts are like the glo fish, once they are injected the fish are then line breed to get the right colors and looks. it does not just happen at once. they have to test run batches to see what comes out then re-test to make sure it is correct.

so yea 5 generations after they got the fish they wanted seems to work. but i bet you only see males come into the market for the first 3-4 years. it would be to easy for people to breed convicts in mass numbers.

i wonder what a reg convict and a glo convict would turn out to be???

[buntbarsch]

It just makes me very sad.........

[Mikeinco]

Sounds to me like someone has way too much time on their hands

[jb1edlover]

Yet another black eye for the fish hobby... sad thing is someone will be keeping them, and no doubt there will be a category for them at fish conventions, soon enough.
JB

[smitty]

I have always been a firm believer that humans always destroy what God has created. People be careful what you wish for and admire. We have not learned a thing from the parrot fish with a mouth that can never close. There mere fact we did not denounce that years ago puzzeled me. Asia have been the most unethical, because they are strictly about the dollar. Somewhat like drug dealers they live large and in charge for sometime only in the vast majority of cases end up behind bars with nothing in the end, or dead. It's called reap what you sew. I am not impressed with what I just seen.

[baldtaxguy]

Umm....Not sure we are talking about the end of the world here with glow in the dark fish. A bit disappointing, but the hobby has more challenges facing it. As an example, I can count 2 members of our cichlid club that is less than 30 years old. I'm a bit more concerned (and sad) about how a major oil company can affect the state of nature and economics.

[Matt Quinn]

Exactly - it's not like man (those money hungry, drug dealing Asians?!) hasn't been breeding captive fish to suit his aesthetic taste since like 200 AD (colored carp).

If fancy fish like these get people into keeping fish...or help lfs stay open...or allow people to otherwise make a living...why isn't it a good thing?

Keep what makes you happy...and try to refrain from making generalizations about the motives and ethics of entire continents of people...

Matt


Umm....Not sure we are talking about the end of the world here with glow in the dark fish. A bit disappointing, but the hobby has more challenges facing it. As an example, I can count 2 members of our cichlid club that is less than 30 years old. I'm a bit more concerned (and sad) about how a major oil company can affect the state of nature and economics.

[smitty]

I guess you did not get the analogy used. But if you see nothing wrong with a fish that can not close its mouth then more power to you.

[Matt Quinn]

They're not my taste but neither are fancy goldfish...or veil Angels or ebjds...all with "enhancements" to make them less viable in the wild and more appealing to some aquarists...

Matt

I guess you did not get the analogy used. But if you see nothing wrong with a fish that can not close its mouth then more power to you.

[ikevi]

... the hobby has more challenges facing it. As an example, I can count 2 members of our cichlid club that is less than 30 years old.


Does your club have an online presence? Because that is the only real way for the "younger" generation is going to even find a fish club. (The AAAA club has been steady increasing in members and most of them are in the 20's to mid 30s as our online presence has improved. In particular the forum.)

While there aren't that many teenagers, we do have a few.

[baldtaxguy]

Does your club have an online presence? Because that is the only real way for the "younger" generation is going to even find a fish club. (The AAAA club has been steady increasing in members and most of them are in the 20's to mid 30s as our online presence has improved. In particular the forum.)

While there aren't that many teenagers, we do have a few.

Yep, gcca.net. And I did not pull birth certs, but there are two college students and then the rest of us.

[ikevi]

Yep, gcca.net. And I did not pull birth certs, but there are two college students and then the rest of us.


Hm, I really don't know. I know that the younger generation of fish keepers exist. The problem is always notifying them that you exist. (Of course even then your club has to be close enough/right time/etc, but still it seems odd that you would have problems finding people in the Chicago area.)

[Matt Quinn]

I think the last poll on mfk revealed over 75% of respondents were <40 years old. Both local and national clubs need to ask why or why aren't these folks not participating in traditional fish clubs. I'd bet that it's not that a $20-ish annual membership is insurmountable ...

In cca we've found that participation of folks other than middle aged/ old white guys reinforces more participation from younger and more diverse groups.

Matt

Hm, I really don't know. I know that the younger generation of fish keepers exist. The problem is always notifying them that you exist. (Of course even then your club has to be close enough/right time/etc, but still it seems odd that you would have problems finding people in the Chicago area.)

[jb1edlover]

In cca we've found that participation of folks other than middle aged/ old white guys reinforces more participation from younger and more diverse groups.

Matt


Hey Matt you just made a Generalization..... just sayin!
JB

[Mullet]

We have gotten a little off-topic but I agree that younger members are needed to grow the clubs. Very few of the clubs I have done talks at have any younger members, but the clubs don't promote a environment that is inviting either.

I can't give you the numbers in the HCCC because if a person becomes a member their entire family are members as well. When you come to our meetings and auctions we typically have a lot of kids and teenagers running around. We always have activities for them to be involved in and make them feel like they belong. Numerous speakers we have brought in have commented on the amount of young people we have and how refreshing it is. Not sure if it exactly related but when we banned alcohol from club events it became much more family oriented immediately. Folks felt comfortable bringing their kids and the people who were only using it as a reason to drink beer disappeared.

Encourage them to write articles for your club publication. Start a kids BAP program...keep it simple...anything they breed is eligible..even if the fry don't survive they get points and certificates for everything...exttra points available for drawing a picture or talking to another member about their expereince...

When I ran for the BOT I mentioned numerous times that the youth are the basis for building membership and developing a long term solution...fell on deaf ears and it seems we all want immediate fixes

[Matt Quinn]

Hey Matt you just made a Generalization..... just sayin!
JB

It's our experience...what can I say?

[Mrfiremouth]

A big part of it is marketing and the Internet.
People can sit at home and log onto a forum or check websites for free and don't need to to go out and meet people in person. For many today, that is the culture they are embracing. Then, there is getting the word out. If more LFS and Box stores promoted local clubs scenes then more people would be aware of the clubs.

[jb1edlover]

Rich.... very true! I unfortunately moved earlier this year away from the HCCC (area) and moved to Southeastern Virginia (Hampton) area. I left San Antonio Tx with a vision of finding another fish club (local) and bringing lots of cool fish from Tx and getting them started here. Now that I've gotten here there are no clubs established and the 3 main LFS's that I approached weren't interested in letting me post flyers to get some folks together... I asked the manager of a very large fish store here why don't they like fish clubs and I was told very directly, "Fish Clubs are our biggest rivalry because they share deals, and fish with each other and it directly affects sales! The next thing you now clubs are selling fish in our parking lot and then we lose customers!" I tried the craigslist thing but I only got weirdo responses and sex replies...... So really without the help of LFS.... small clubs don't stand a chance unless you approach customers directly in the stores! Anyway I know I'm only 3 Hours from Washington D.C. so I might try to affiliate with the capital guys!
JB

P.S. Mullet you had my vote, and if you ever run again you will get it again! I've seen first hand the things you guys have done over there at the HCCC.

[Mullet]

Thanks JB, I appreciate it. I don't see myself running again. Don't want to deal with uphill climbs constantly.

I feel we are too concerned about a membership number instead of looking in the mirrur and being concerned with why are we losing members.

Everyone thinks the hybrid debate went away...it didn't, but we decided for the betterment of the ACA to keep it off this board and put our money where our mouth is in South Texas...the development on the HCCC CARES/FOTAS convention was a direct result of this.

It is going to be huge and the speaker lineup will be second to none

Ad Konings

Melanie Stiassny

Paul Loiselle

Les Kaufman

Charles Jones

Kathy England

Anton Lamboj

The BABES will be there as well. Every talk will be be related to either conservation or CARES species

[jb1edlover]

Amazing line-up! I'll be there!
JB

[Dean Hougen]

Dave, you definitely should run for the BOT again and do it this year! Please reconsider. We could really use you. It will be an uphill climb but the good it will do will be worth it.

JB, I sympathize with you about trying to get clubs started. It is not easy and your experience with fish stores is pretty common. Many store owners see clubs as the competition, since we do breed fish and sell them to each other, do group orders, etc. However, what they are missing is that it is not a zero sum game. It is not that person X is going to buy one tank, one filter, and 20 fish this year, either from the store or the club, so the store needs to shut out the club to get that business. Instead, person X without a club may buy one tank, one filter, and 20 fish this year from the store, fail at fish keeping and sell the tank and filter at a yard sale and be done with the hobby. Or perhaps person X without a club may actually succeed at keeping the fish alive and may keep their tank and fish for several years before getting bored and moving on to something else. On the other hand, that same person X who makes contact with a club is not only more likely to succeed with keeping their fish alive, they are likely to go crazy with multiple tank syndrome and buy a dozen tanks this year or twenty next year as well as dozens of filters, hundreds of fish, etc., and stay in the hobby for many, many years to come. They won't buy all this from the store but they will buy some of it from the store and they are likely to raise awareness of the hobby locally and bring even more people into it. Clubs have a huge multiplier effect on the hobby. Store owners need to realize that 100% of one is less than 50% of 100.


Dean

[ds1196]

I couldn't have said it better, Dean. As a store owner myself, I wouldn't be where I am today without my local club. In addition, the group orders from other clubs outside my area work greatly to my benefit. Summers are always a slow time for the hobby, so the annual group buy that I get from the ECC/CCA really helps carry me through that. They basically paid for my trip to the convention and then some!

[jb1edlover]

Dave,
As a member of that local fish club... we also wouldn't be where we are without the support of "Daves Rare Fish" as well as some other LFS.... it goes hand and hand!
JB